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Post by jobee on Jan 27, 2007 4:30:04 GMT -5
Many centuries ago, when most people had no education and therefore could not prove nor disprove anything, there were people who had what these days we call "religious experiences"; they know now, and did know then, that "out there" there is something or somebody who (sometimes? often? always?) helps them when no other help is available (only if one deserves to be helped?). ..... Natural events, such as lightning/thunder, rain, snow, floods, weather, growth of food and of babies, etc. obviously were NOT created by people nor by animals, so they specified and speculated who created all that and who did all the managing of natural events. People wanted to have all that explained from people who claimed to know "everything". These people had to have answers to all these (pesky?) questions and when they didn't know the answers, then for political reasons they couldn't admit that. Instead they made up all sorts of "explanations", and many religion-fiction stories and elaborate mythology became parts of the newly invented belief systems. These also included various laws/requirements/dogma/rituals etc., enacted by unelected clergy who, I repeat, were the governments all over this planet, and they insisted that these laws were made by God, or Allah, or one of many gods, etc. and had to be obeyed, or else. There are now very many belief systems all over this planet, and some of them have different versions. Lots of people pay their hard-earned money to these and (believe? insist? think?) that they get good value for their money. You too? Date: 2007-01-26 09:11:54 johnb ( john.bishop2@ntlworld.com) Never heard of PB. This debate is not about poetry. It’s about when are the big religions going to prove their theory that god/heaven exist. The Roman Catholic Church has murdered millions over the centuries trying to force this theory down their throats. Even today, in many parts of the world people are to terrified to admit they are non believers. Worst still, these terrifying religious regimes are getting tax concessions from governments. Unless they can prove their ‘trouble making’ theory many people think those tax concessions should stop. Pat is’ not’ discussing, I noticed you left her out of it. Also I do not like anons If you haven’t got the guts to come ’up front’ then don’t bother. The free thinkers are not getting tax concessions. All the main religions have had thousands of years to prove their theory that god and heaven are a reality they have not proved that theory. They are still ’selling the dummy’ and getting tax concessions to sell it. This ‘selling the dummy’ brings in that much money that businessmen have ‘gone private’ in a bid for power and money. Impressionable young people have been blowing themselves up and taking others with them in the belief that they are going to some heavenly utopia. Now, will all the main religions either prove their theory or stop preaching it as reality. Would governments kindly stop giving them tax concessions for ‘selling the dummy’ two.guestbook.de/gb.cgi?gid=712376&prot=renxrxtwo.guestbook.de/gb.cgi?gid=712376&prot=renxrx
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Post by Steady Micro Aggressor on Jan 27, 2007 9:21:40 GMT -5
I'm very aware of you opinions about religion and faith John. You're entitled to believe the way you'd like. I respect your right to not believe in God. That is ultimately your choice. I do not pass judgement on you, that is not my place. To be honest with you, I have use for organized religion at all. Whether it's the Kathlicks, Protostants, or whoever, I have no use it. The workings of organized religion remind me of the workings of big government. Religion is a form of socialism.
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Post by jobee on Jan 28, 2007 4:46:15 GMT -5
I'm very aware of you opinions about religion and faith John. You're entitled to believe the way you'd like. I respect your right to not believe in God. That is ultimately your choice. I do not pass judgement on you, that is not my place. To be honest with you, I have use for organized religion at all. Whether it's the Kathlicks, Protostants, or whoever, I have no use it. The workings of organized religion remind me of the workings of big government. Religion is a form of socialism. Even islam, a known 'religious/political 'organisation is getting tax concessions over here to build more mosques. This madness as gotta stop- They can't even prove what the're praying to.j
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Post by Steady Micro Aggressor on Jan 28, 2007 9:29:54 GMT -5
jb: Even islam, a known 'religious/political 'organisation is getting tax concessions over here to build more mosques. This madness as gotta stop- They can't even prove what the're praying to.j
You know, I do have sympathy with your point of view about organized religion getting tax breaks. It wouldn't bother me if that were ended.
I don't think I have the right to expect another person to prove their faith or God to me. Nor do you have to prove their isn't a God to me or anyone else. People should have the right to believe as they choose.
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Post by jobee on Jan 28, 2007 17:35:54 GMT -5
jb: Even islam, a known 'religious/political 'organisation is getting tax concessions over here to build more mosques. This madness as gotta stop- They can't even prove what the're praying to.j You know, I do have sympathy with your point of view about organized religion getting tax breaks. It wouldn't bother me if that were ended. I don't think I have the right to expect another person to prove their faith or God to me. Nor do you have to prove their isn't a God to me or anyone else. People should have the right to believe as they choose. You are a phony-after 2000 years of organised religion their best brains should at least prove it-what a racket!
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Post by Steady Micro Aggressor on Jan 29, 2007 8:09:42 GMT -5
John: You are a phony-after 2000 years of organised religion their best brains should at least prove it-what a racket!
That response is irrational, and illogical. No one has to prove anything to you. People are free to believe as they chose. You'll have to find a way to deal with those who chose to live differently than you.
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Post by jobee on Jan 29, 2007 11:07:47 GMT -5
John: You are a phony-after 2000 years of organised religion their best brains should at least prove it-what a racket! That response is irrational, and illogical. No one has to prove anything to you. People are free to believe as they chose. You'll have to find a way to deal with those who chose to live differently than you. Faith is self indulgence-what are goverments giving tax concessions to self indulgence for-your on your old string along thing again-young people are blowing themselves up in the belief they are going to some heavenly utopia-ban organised religion its just stagnation.j
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Post by Steady Micro Aggressor on Jan 30, 2007 12:28:55 GMT -5
jb: Faith is self indulgence-what are goverments giving tax concessions to self indulgence for-your on your old string along thing again-young people are blowing themselves up in the belief they are going to some heavenly utopia-ban organised religion its just stagnation.j
To you, faith is self indulgence. I can understand that line of thinking. I see self indulgence in religion. It's one reason that I just don't go to church much, if at all anymore. But what I think, or you think may not be shared by others. Neither me, or you has the right to tell other people what they can, or can't believe to the degree it would require to enforce a ban on organized Religion.
You can't just ban organized religion in either the US or England. What would you suggest, that people who conduct Church be rounded and and jailed? That we start burning Bible, Torahs, and Korans? I simply cannot support such antics by the government. Beside's it's illogical to attempt to ban thought.
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Post by jobee on Feb 4, 2007 18:09:29 GMT -5
jb: Faith is self indulgence-what are goverments giving tax concessions to self indulgence for-your on your old string along thing again-young people are blowing themselves up in the belief they are going to some heavenly utopia-ban organised religion its just stagnation.j To you, faith is self indulgence. I can understand that line of thinking. I see self indulgence in religion. It's one reason that I just don't go to church much, if at all anymore. But what I think, or you think may not be shared by others. Neither me, or you has the right to tell other people what they can, or can't believe to the degree it would require to enforce a ban on organized Religion. You can't just ban organized religion in either the US or England. What would you suggest, that people who conduct Church be rounded and and jailed? That we start burning Bible, Torahs, and Korans? I simply cannot support such antics by the government. Beside's it's illogical to attempt to ban thought. Ok you dont care, keep making a quid running sites.
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Post by Steady Micro Aggressor on Feb 5, 2007 7:09:16 GMT -5
jb: Ok you dont care, keep making a quid running sites.
That response is immaterial, and irrelevant. Caring isn't a logical basis to make such choices. Please contain your petty emotional indulgences and stick with the point.
You simply can't ban thought, nor is it desireable to restrict association to the degree you suggest. That is the point, address it. Your irrational attacks of me have grown boring.
Might I remind you this site is about the exchanging of opinions and ideas, not a competition to see who "cares" the most. I will indeed continue running this site. I'm pleased you approve.
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Post by jobee on Feb 9, 2007 11:30:35 GMT -5
jb: Faith is self indulgence-what are goverments giving tax concessions to self indulgence for-your on your old string along thing again-young people are blowing themselves up in the belief they are going to some heavenly utopia-ban organised religion its just stagnation.j To you, faith is self indulgence. I can understand that line of thinking. I see self indulgence in religion. It's one reason that I just don't go to church much, if at all anymore. But what I think, or you think may not be shared by others. Neither me, or you has the right to tell other people what they can, or can't believe to the degree it would require to enforce a ban on organized Religion. You can't just ban organized religion in either the US or England. What would you suggest, that people who conduct Church be rounded and and jailed? That we start burning Bible, Torahs, and Korans? I simply cannot support such antics by the government. Beside's it's illogical to attempt to ban thought. [/quotits its always been violent THE ENFORCERS 1450 pope Nicholas v .orders all muslims and non christians into perpetual slavery. -------- - Pope Clement V. orders the destruction of the Knights Templers and condones torture to get confessions .1308 =======- Sixtus the1V says nothing when, Isobell of spain starts the spanish Inquisistion ========== - Pope ?Innocent? theV111 orders the death of all magicians. 1487. =========== - 1233= Pope Gregory .wants an inquisition to start, and orders the Dominicans to manage it, under penalty of death, for refusal ======= - Pope Innocent the V111 orders the Inquisition to commence.1487. ============= The vatican under Clement V111 burns Geo Bruno at the stake For heresy,.for agreeing with Copernicas. =========== Galileo tried in Rome and threatened with torture,for agreeing with Copernicas.1633. -------------- Pope innocent 111 offers the command of the forth crusade to 'Boniface the 111 of monferat ---------------- Pope Innocent 111 sends the abbot of citeaux to eradicate
the heresy in lanquedot. . -------------------------------- Pope Innocent 111 preaches a crusade against the 'heretic'Cathars of albi. ----------------------- An army is sent by Pope Gregory 1X to eradicate the non christian lands of Frederick 11. ---------------------------
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Post by Steady Micro Aggressor on Feb 14, 2007 16:03:08 GMT -5
jb: Faith is self indulgence-what are goverments giving tax concessions to self indulgence for-your on your old string along thing again-young people are blowing themselves up in the belief they are going to some heavenly utopia-ban organised religion
John, please restrain your leaps of illogic. You continue to rattle on about tax concessions to religious organizations even though I have posted my indifference to taxing churches. I can only chuckle when you try to argue with me, while having no clue what I think.
People kill in the name of government and related politics. Should we ban governments?
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Post by jobee on May 9, 2007 10:44:35 GMT -5
you might as well ban your goverments-you dont vote for them
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Post by Steady Micro Aggressor on May 9, 2007 17:43:09 GMT -5
jb: you might as well ban your goverments-you dont vote for them
Oh man, you can't be serious John? So, according to you, life must go like we think it should. If not, we're supposed to silence the other side? You really are a Nazi aren't you?
jb says he's elderly, but he sounds like a teenager. I mean to suggest that just because the people I support don't win, I'm supposed to go off the deep end like jb does in this forum? John, my life doesn't depend on which liar wins the election. I know self reliance is a difficult concept for you, you being a ward of the state and all that, but it's far more rewarding than being a slave.
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